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Rain Country, A High Water Table, and Door Options

This week the Pole Barn Guru answers reader questions about any added features for “rain country” like western Washington, use of UC-4B pressure preservative treated columns in a high water table area, and the options of a sliding door vs a sectional overhead door in an RV storage building.

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: Do many people build Hansen barndos in western Washington rain country and if so what added features. Are to be considered in heavy rain areas. DALE in WEST RICHLAND

DEAR DALE: Thank you for your interest in a new Hansen Pole Building. We have provided over 1000 fully engineered post frame buildings to our clients in Washington State, more than any other state!

There are some keys to success when building in any wet/damp climate.

Good site preparation is foremost. You want to have your concrete slab on grade to be poured on top of six to 12 inches of a properly compacted sub base, then add another two to six inches of sand or sandy gravel, before placing vapor barrier and any under slab insulation.

Building footprint should have a finished grade high enough to allow surrounding ground to be finish graded to slope away from building at no less than a 5% grade for 10 feet.

Building should have eave overhangs (12 to 24 inches) with gutters. Gutters should have drain exits at least 10 feet away from building.

Place a well-sealed Weather Resistant Barrier between wall girts and siding.

 

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: Going to build 2 pole barns on my property in Wewahitchka Florida about 15 miles from Mexico Beach. Water table on property is high and in a three foot post hole the water will seep and maintain 2 foot of water. Besides having a potential of hurricane winds what do you feel is best to withstand the water and winds over time for the supporting posts? Some I have read say wet set anchors are a pivot point not good for hurricane situations? Some posts in the ground not to weaken the post when blown by hurricane winds. Please inform best way and I am putting in for a quote from your company. ED in WEWAHITCHKA

DEAR ED: Embedded columns will be far more resistant to wind loads than bracket mounts.

If it was my own building(s), I would build up my site with compactable fill about two feet (compacted no less than every six inches) then sloped away from building no less than 5% for 10 feet or more. I’d then use columns embedded in ground.

 

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: I am exploring options for a garage for my 33ft 5th wheel RV. My RV is 12.5 ft tall, so looking at a 14 ft high door opening. Door Width will be 12 ft total. I’m looking at dual external sliding doors vs. a large and expensive rollup door. Is there a way to seal or insulate a sliding door setup? The only sliding door setups I am familiar with leave gaps at the sides, bottom, top. I have not decided if I will go metal kit, pole barn, or a traditional 2×4 and truss method for the structure. Thanks ROB in HERNDON

RV Storage BuildingDEAR ROB: After roughly 20,000 buildings, I have yet to have any client wish they would have installed sliding doors, rather than sectional steel overhead doors.

Your downsides of sliding doors are many. They will only seal tight enough to allow your neighbor’s cat to get in (not to mention the mice being chased by said cat). They cannot be effectively insulated. While electric openers are available, they are not for those who are faint of pocket book (read more about electric sliding door openers here: https://www.hansenpolebuildings.com/2017/04/propel-electric-door-openers/).

Most importantly, sliding doors are not wind load rated. This can become highly problematic. https://www.hansenpolebuildings.com/2014/12/wind-load-rated-garage-doors/

 

 

This entry was posted in Footings, Pole Barn holes, Building Drainage, Building Interior, Uncategorized, Pole Barn Questions, Budget, Pole Barn Design, Columns, Pole Building How To Guides, RV Storage, Pole Barn Planning, Sectional Doors, Concrete and tagged , , , , , , , , , on by .

Post Footing and Site Leveling

Post Footing and Site Leveling

Reader KEVIN in PAOLA writes:

“I’ve been working with Cory on my building design and had a question regarding leveling my site and setting my posts. The plan is a 40′ x 60′ building with a 17′ eave height. On the south side, there will be a 12′ attached shed that is open. Based on the elevations I’ve shot, I’ll have to add approximately 4′ of fill on the east end of the building and it gradually tapers all the way to the west end. Now, rock on the property is rather shallow. I dug a test hole on the east end which will require the most fill and the rock is about 2′ below native ground level. I’ve encountered solid limestone that is approximately 2′ thick when digging corner posts and I’ve found locations where the rock is fractured and can be dug out with an excavator. The county requires poles be installed at a minimum depth of 4′, but will allow 30″-40″ if due to rock and if the holes are backfilled with concrete.

· How would you design the foundation for the poles?
· Does the 4′ of backfill count when measuring post embedment?
· Would you set the posts first and then add the fill?
· Do you change post foundation design as you move from the deeper fill for elevation on the east end to fill on the west end that is replacing the top soil?
· Does the post foundation design change for the open shed on the south side?

I’m attaching the design doc from the county. Foundation information is listed on pages 8 and 9.

I hope all of this makes sense and thank you for the help.”

Thank you for reaching out to me. With your permission, I would like to treat your building as if it was my own (in other words, What Would the Pole Barn Guru Do?).

Project# 05-0211Starting with your door end (which I will assume is uphill), I would add enough fill so this end could have holes dug to 40″, filling balance of site accordingly. All fill should be compacted in no less than six-inch lifts to a minimum of 90% of Modified Proctor Density (you may need to invest in a Geotechnical Engineer to verify compaction).

Foundation would be embedded columns to 40″ depth and would be same for all areas (our engineers will seal holes at 40″ depth) Properly compacted fill can be relied upon to be equal to undisturbed soil Fill first – it is so much easier than trying to work around columns.

On door end, you will want to grade away from doors, so water coming down hill does not end up running into your building.

This entry was posted in Pole Barn holes, Uncategorized, Pole Barn Design, Pole Building How To Guides, Pole Barn Planning, Pole Barn Structure, Footings, Professional Engineer, Columns and tagged , , , , , , on by .

Fill to Grade, XPS Between Steel and Framing, and a Post Frame Home

This Wednesday the Pole Barn Guru advises readers on adding 6″ fill to the site and the affect it would have on columns, the use of XPS insulation between the steel and framing of the building, and some thoughts on building a 3 bedroom, two bath house.

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: Hello, The site I am looking to build a pole barn had to be filled to bring the area up to a level grade. The depth of the fill is about 6′ at the deepest point. How does this impact the setting of the post? CRAIG in EAST WATERBORO

DEAR CRAIG: Provided fill was mechanically compacted to no less than 90% of a Modified Proctor Density in lifts no greater than six inches, it can be treated as native soil. If proper compaction was not achieved, then columns should be lengthened in order to provide full embedment into undisturbed soil beneath fill.

 

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: So I was going to place 2 layers of 1″ xps foam under my metal on the walls and roof of my pole barn. So it would be, purlins 2 1inch of xps and then my metal, is this a good or bad idea? Thanks BJ in JACKSON

Pole Barn Guru BlogDEAR BJ: Absolutely a bad idea. Pole barns “work” (e.g. stay standing) due to shear strength of steel sheeting (or OSB, plywood, etc., if used). When you place insulation boards between steel and framing, you are severely impacting ability of steel to carry those loads, as steel can shift slightly under wind loads. Eventually this will cause screw shank deformation (would take some very long screws), as well as slotting under screw gaskets, creating leaking (provided building doesn’t just fail first). If you really want to use XPS sheets, cut them to fit snugly between purlins and girts, taping all edges to achieve a tight seal.

 

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: I would like to think of something for my 2 boys and I. One story 3 bed 2 bath. Living room dining room kitchen, laundry room with walk in closets. About what size would you recommend? SHANNON in KIPTON

DEAR SHANNON: In order to determine best size for any particular client, I encourage them (and you) to utilize links found at #3 in this article https://www.hansenpolebuildings.com/2021/02/a-shortlist-for-smooth-barndominium-sailing/ This will assist you to work towards your ideal dream home, within budget.

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HOA Restrictions, Plans Only Option (sorry, no) and Site Prep

This week the Pole Barn Guru addresses reader questions about the possibility of adding a brick exterior to a pole building to satisfy HOA restrictions, if Hansen provides a sealed plans only option so a reader can reuse parts of current building, and geotechnical concerns about site prep and dirt for post frame construction.

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: I live in a HOA restricted area that states exteriors must be brick or brick veneer. I purchased the neighboring lot in order to build a 3/4 bay shop on that lot. Is there a way to brick veneer the exterior of one of your buildings? It has to closely match my existing house. Can email you more pictures if that would be helpful. CHAD in JEFFERSONVILLE

DEAR CHAD: HOAs are always a challenge (https://www.hansenpolebuildings.com/2016/12/hoa-requirements/). There are a plethora of ‘thin brick’ options available (please Google “Thin Brick”) any of them can be readily applied to a properly engineered post frame building. I say ‘properly engineered’ as building and wall deflection needs to be limited in order to prevent cracking of veneer.

 

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: Can I hire you to design a pole barn and get sealed prints for NJ without buying the kit from you? I have a fairly new pole barn on the property and would like to reuse that material for my new barn. SHANE in BRIDGETON

DEAR SHANE: As some of our components are proprietary, our engineers will only seal plans when we are providing materials.

 

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: The person that will be doing the dirt work for the foundation asked me a question concerning the columns in the ground. He asked if the column will require certain type or quality of dirt, or if there are any samples taken to determine the depth. I have read on your website about all the factors that are taken into consideration when determining the depth of the hole and size of the columns, but I don’t remember seeing anything about soil samples. Thank you in advance for your time. ALLEN in CABOT

DEAR ALLEN: In an ideal dream world, our clients would have a geotechnical engineer do an onsite evaluation of soil strengths and forward to us.

Without this information, our engineers use presumptive load-bearing values found in IRC (International Residential Code) Table R401.4.1 and IBC (International Building Code) Table 1806.2. From decades of experience, these values end up being very conservative in relationship to actual geotechnical testing results.

Most important, if you are bringing in fill, is for it to be adequately compacted in no greater than six inch lifts.

One of our previous clients had some site preparation questions answered for his particular circumstances, his experience may prove helpful to you: https://www.hansenpolebuildings.com/2017/02/building-site-preparation/

This entry was posted in Alternate Siding, Rebuilding Structures, Professional Engineer, Pole Barn Questions, Pole Barn Design, Pole Building How To Guides, Pole Barn Planning, Pole Barn Structure, Pole Building Siding, Footings and tagged , , , , , , , , on by .

Insulation, Truss Spans, and Pit Material

Today’s Ask the Pole Barn Guru discusses reader questions about an option to layer insulation between purlins, the actual building width for 36′ trusses, and the recommendation against the use pit material when performing site prep.

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: Hi, I have the traditional roll type insulation with the white backing. My question is if I’m able to add more insulation between the purlins on top of the existing insulation for added r value and what type would you recommend if so? Thanks OWEN in VIVIAN

DEAR OWEN: Metal Building Insulation (MBI) is not my favorite design solution for post frame insulation (read more here: https://www.hansenpolebuildings.com/2011/11/metal-building-insulation/).

You can add more insulation to interior of what you have, without having to perforate white vinyl of you MBI. I would recommend adding unfaced Rockwool, as it is not affected by moisture and has a relatively high R value per inch of thickness compared to fiberglass or cellulose. Do not add another interior vapor barrier, as this would allow for moisture to become trapped between two vapor barriers.

 

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: You really are a wealth of knowledge.  I’ve been watching your Youtube videos as well, very helpful.

I’m intrigued by your pole barn kits, and I had just one more question about raised heel trusses:

It’s my understanding that post spans are actually building widths minus 3 inches.  So for a 36 foot building, the span between posts is 35’ 9”, correct?  If that’s the case, are raised heel truss lengths in this example also 35’ 9 to the edge of the post?  Or the full 36’, with the eave skirt board resting under the additional 1.5 inches of the bottom chord length?

Thanks again for your time!!! MATT in CHENEY

DEAR MATT: Our buildings (as are most Pacific Northwest Buildings) measure 36 feet from outside of column to outside of column. This allows for 12 sheets of steel plus the lap on the 12th piece (covering 36′ 1-1/2″ roughly) to be installed without having to rip the last steel panel lengthwise. Pressure preservative treated splash planks, headers, etc. will be applied to exterior faces of columns, giving a framed finished width of 36’3″.

 

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: Hi. In your building manual it notes not to use pit material on the building pad. If the site is leveled, I’m not sure what the function of any modified is or why no pit material in specific. We’ll be doing a slab at some point and common practice would be to put down some clean 3/4″ so if it’s beneficial to have stone on the building pad would it be more cost efficient to just put the clean stone down to start with? Thanks. KEVIN in WEST CALN

DEAR KEVIN: #1 reason to not use pit run is it is difficult to auger holes through.

#2 because it is round, it does not compact well

#3 It creates voids allowing for free flow of liquid water beneath slab

You do want to allow for two to six inches of clean sand or sandy gravel compacted immediately below your under slab vapor barrier.

 

This entry was posted in Insulation, Pole Barn Questions, Pole Barn Design, Constructing a Pole Building, Pole Building How To Guides, Trusses, Concrete, Columns and tagged , , , , , on by .

Materials for Girts, a Raised Floor, Truss Loads

This week the Pole Barn Guru answers reader questions about girt material choices for a 60’x120′ shed, Mike’s thoughts on a raised floor to compensate for a 7% grade change, and if some 4′ oc trusses can handle the load of a heater.

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: I plan on putting up a 60′ x 120′ post frame shed. I’m going to run my 6×6 posts at 8′ o.c. can I use all 8′ 2×6 material for the girts or should I have some 16′ material staggered in with the 8′ material? Will that increase the strength or do you think it would be similar? Thanks guru! JASON in NEW HOLSTEIN

DEAR JASON: Depending upon eave height, design snow and wind loads and wind exposure 6×6 may be inadequate to carry imposed loads. Using 16′ external girt material will be slightly stiffer against wind loads perpendicular to girt and will deflect slightly less. They will not impact overall building strength. Depending upon spacing, grade and species of 2×6, and again design wind speed and wind exposure, they may also prove to be inadequate.

Personally, I would look at using glu-laminated columns every 12′, double trusses directly aligned with columns and 2×6 bookshelf style wall girts. This will result in fewer holes to dig and fewer pieces to have to handle and install. It also allows for wider sidewall door openings, without requiring large headers.

 

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: I’m building a home on land that is at a 7% grade from top to bottom. I was thinking about doing a raised floor/crawlspace with the back aligned closer to grade and the front more elevated. What are your thoughts on this idea, and elevated floor pole buildings generally? I assume you would support the floor with piers instead of spanning entirely? Thanks! MATTHEW in HOUSTON

DEAR MATTHEW: Having built for myself an elevated floor post frame building (I had 14 feet of grade change in 24 feet), I feel as though they are a great solution. Unless you had enough grade change to practically utilize space below, I would use interior columns to reduce spans of beams and joists – little, short columns being far less expensive than large multiple ply beams and large dimension floor joists. My knees also prefer to live on wood, rather than concrete – making this a double win.

 

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: Hot Dawg™ heater…..just built a 40×30 pole barn. 4/12 roof, trusses are 4′ apart, wanting to hang a 80kbtu heater from trusses, with steel channels being suspended from two trusses. Will trusses handle the weight? Thank you. SHARKBITE

DEAR SHARKBITE: In order to determine if your trusses can handle weight of this unit, you would need to look at your engineer sealed roof truss drawings. If Bottom Chord Dead Load (often shown as BCDL) is less than five (5) psf (pounds per square foot) then probably not. Ideally, reach out to whomever fabricated your trusses. Give them weight of your unit, where you propose to hang it, as well as if you have a ceiling and insulation and they can give you a definitive thumbs up or down.

This entry was posted in Professional Engineer, Lofts, Pole Barn Heating, Lumber, Pole Barn Questions, Pole Barn Design, Constructing a Pole Building, Pole Barn Planning, Trusses and tagged , , , , , , , on by .

Moisture Reduction, Window Sizes on a Building, and Frost Heave

Today the Pole Barn Guru addresses reader questions about moisture reduction in pole barn with dirt floor, what size windows can be added to a structure, and how to eliminate frost heave.

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: I have a 60 x 120′ pole barn with dirt floors and an insulated ceiling 18′ high. I believe the walls are also insulated but I haven’t checked. It stays very humid in there with the service door closed, which I like to do in the winter. There are 6 modestly sized windows but they’re 10′ high, hard to close in the rain and don’t ventilate much. I assume all this moisture is from the soil, is there a cost effective way to add a floor moisture barrier? ROSS in NORTHFIELD

DEAR ROSS: You are correct about where moisture is coming from – and it is made even worse in Winter, when ground outside of your building is frozen and inside your building is where all ground moisture is trying to escape (basically think of your building as being a cork pulled out of a genie’s bottle). While pouring a concrete slab on grade of a vapor barrier would be your best (and permanent) solution, concrete is costly. With this said, my best recommendation would be to remove top two inches of dirt inside of your building, making sure there are no sharp rocks projecting up above surface. Place a 15mil black vapor barrier across entire floor, overlapping seams by 12 inches and taping them tightly shut. Run vapor barrier up onto splash planks on walls (if possible) as well as sealing to each column. Cover vapor barrier with two inches of clean sand. You may need to mechanically dehumidify, in order to fully resolve your challenges.

 

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: Hello I am curious about window sizing in post frame buildings. Can I add any size window I want in any wall without affecting the structural integrity of the building? My largest windows are roughly 42″ wide by 64″ tall. WESLEY in DULUTH

steel pole building metal interiorDEAR WESLEY: Post frame buildings “work” due to their skin. Placing openings, without approval from your building’s engineer, could result in catastrophic structural failure.

For extended reading, please visit: https://www.hansenpolebuildings.com/2011/12/lateral-wind-loads/

 

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: The frost heave issue: how does a guy insulate his foundation? TONY in MARION

DEAR TONY: Most important for avoiding frost heave is having a properly prepared building site: https://www.hansenpolebuildings.com/2011/10/preventing_frost_heaves_in_pole_building_construction/
Here is information on insulating: https://www.hansenpolebuildings.com/2022/09/272982/

This entry was posted in Pole Barn Questions, Pole Barn Design, Constructing a Pole Building, Pole Barn Planning, Ventilation, Windows, Professional Engineer, Pole Barn Heating, Insulation and tagged , , , , , , on by .

Site Prep, Proper Sheathing for home, and Jamb Latch Details

Today the Pole Barn Guru addresses reader questions about site preparation for a post frame building, reflective radiant barrier or sheathing needed for a post frame home, and a detail for a jamb latch on a sliding door.

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: I been watching a lot of your videos on YouTube, I wish you guys were closer to me. I’m in the process of building my own. I have a question, I’m about 3′ different from hit to low. I plan on bring in 1″ road down stone and compacting it down to raise the elevation close to the highest point. Would be this be sufficient? The post from is 40×56. The elevation is from back vs the front (mostly on one corner is the major elevation change). TIM

DEAR TIM: Thank you for reaching out to us.

Hansen Pole Buildings is America’s leader in providing fully engineered, 100% custom designed, post frame building and barndominium kits, with multiple buildings in all 50 states. Your deliveries come from one or more of our thousands of shipping locations across the country (minimizing delivery costs) – so chances are excellent we are ‘close’ to you (as well as supporting your local economy)!

I have penned an entire series on site preparation:

https://www.hansenpolebuildings.com/2011/11/site-preparation/
https://www.hansenpolebuildings.com/2011/11/soil-compaction/
https://www.hansenpolebuildings.com/2011/11/soil-moisture-content/
https://www.hansenpolebuildings.com/2011/11/soil-density/
https://www.hansenpolebuildings.com/2011/11/soil-compaction-how-to/

We would appreciate the opportunity to participate in your new pole building. Please email your building specifics, site address and best contact number to our Design Studio Manager Caleb@HansenPoleBuildings.com 1(866)200-9657 Thank you.

 

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: I am building a post barn residential home and using solar guard insulation on the roof and outside walls under the metal. Is zip system – OSB sheathing still needed or even recommended? Some people say it would be just a waste and is not necessary and others say it absolutely is! I’m so confused and lost! Please help!! MATTIE in LEXINGTON

Reflective InsulationDEAR MATTIE: Solar Guard is a Reflective Radiant Barrier, it is truly not insulation. Provided you have taped all of the seams, it should work well as a condensation control between your building’s roof purlins and roof steel. It is the absolute wrong product to use in your building’s walls. You should use a Weather Resistant Barrier (think Tyvek or similar) between framing and steel siding (unless you are planning on closed cell spray foam insulation – it should be sprayed directly to inside of wall steel).

Unless your building’s engineer has specified solid sheathing for structural purposes, there would be no reason to incorporate OSB, plywood or zip system – other than adding to cost, a very minimal increase in R value and perhaps some sound deadening (investing in good insulation will be a better solution for sound control).

 

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: Do you have a larger detail on how a side mounted jamb latch works on a sliding barn door?? Thanks MIKE in SAUK RAPIDS

DEAR MIKE: This should help:

This entry was posted in Professional Engineer, Pole Barn Homes, Insulation, Pole Barn Questions, Sliding Doors, Pole Barn Design, Barndominium, Roofing Materials, Pole Building How To Guides, Pole Barn Planning, Pole Building Siding, Ventilation and tagged , , , , , on by .

Building Codes, Site Prep, and Heating & Cooling Efficiency

This Wednesday the Pole Barn Guru answers reader questions about whether or not a Hansen Building meets Florida/Dade building codes + a few others, optimal materials for site prep on a grade, and heating & cooling efficiency in a long, narrow structure.

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: A few questions:- Do your products meet Miami/Dade building codes? If no you can ignore the remaining questions.- Do you build telephone style structures?- Have you built projects for zoos?- Have you built animal habitats, climbing structures for monkeys? You can call me for more information. Thank you. CHARLES in KISSIMMEE

DEAR CHARLES: Yes, our fully engineered buildings can meet or exceed Miami/Dade building codes.

We are not contractors, so we do not build anything. We provide fully engineered custom kits – designed to be erected D-I-Y or (for those without time or inclination) by a building erector of our client’s choice.

We do not use telephone (utility) poles for any of our buildings, whether new or recycled. We have provided buildings at zoos, amongst them would be Cheyenne Mountain (Colorado Springs, Colorado) Zoo’s Nature Center and Las Vegas, Nevada zoo’s giraffe barn. Our buildings incorporate structural aspects needed to adequate enclose spaces – roof, walls, doors, windows, any elevated wood floors and stairs. Non-structural aspects of our buildings are left to our clients.

 

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: I’m building a pole barn on an uneven build site and am trying to figure out the best material to level the site with. I need as much as 3ft of material in some areas. I can get sand for cheap nearby but I didn’t know if it was the appropriate material for setting poles.

As an added complication, I’ve already acquired my poles, which won’t reach the soil beneath the fill material. However, I will be compacting the material in lifts. REID

DEAR REID: While sand compacts well, it also is prone to washouts. Please read: https://www.hansenpolebuildings.com/2011/11/site-preparation/
and subsequent four articles to follow (use right arrow at bottom of article to move to next).

 

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: I’ve enjoyed perusing your website 😉 We will be building at some point in the next few years, land is already purchased. I designed our current home, but plan to have help on our future home.
The prettier view will be to the North, but I always want Southern exposure in every room possible. Do you think it is a bad idea to design a home that is only one room (24’) deep? It would be long and narrow. I guess my primary concern is heating & cooling efficiency.
Any thoughts you can share would be greatly appreciated! I will likely get back to you for a quote on designing our home, when I get my ideas pulled together. JOYCE in QUINCY

DEAR JOYCE: Provided you are able to locate your HVAC so it is centralized heating and cooling should not be an issue with a long and narrow floor plan. You see this regularly done with manufactured housing.

Your biggest challenge will be laying out rooms so they can have both a North view and a Southern exposure. Unless your plan is to have basically only three major room zones, say a great room in center with a bedroom suite to each side of it, you are going to either be forced to have a hallway, or rooms with only either a view or exposure.

Our staff floor plan experts can help to create your ideal dream floor plan with this look. Every barndominium Hansen Pole Buildings provides is 100% custom designed to best meet the wants and needs of our clients and their loved ones, please see #3 here to assist in determining needed spaces and approximate sizes, and to have professional floor plans and elevation drawings produced affordably. https://www.hansenpolebuildings.com/2021/02/a-shortlist-for-smooth-barndominium-sailing/

This entry was posted in Building Interior, Professional Engineer, Columns, Pole Barn Homes, Pole Barn Heating, Pole Barn Questions, Pole Barn Design, Pole Barn Planning, floorplans and tagged , , , , , , , on by .

Site Prep, Brackets on Slab, and Treated Lumber

This Wednesday the Pole Barn Guru answers reader questions about site preparation and underground obstructions, a recommendation for building with wet set brackets on slab, and whether or not Hansen Buildings uses lumber treated for in-ground use– UC-4B.

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: We recently started the ground work for our future 48×72 pole building. Half way through excavation the crew hit a solid slab of rock at the corner of our building site. It appears to be Pennsylvania blue stone and the space that it takes up includes a majority of the back and left side where the building walls would sit. We were able to achieve a level pad but we are extremely concerned that now we won’t be able to build on this site. This is the only place on our property that has room for this build and we are very worried that we won’t be able to set poles in the ground do to the size of this solid slab. What are our options, if any? KIMBERLY in PENNSYLVANIA

DEAR KIMBERLY: This brought back childhood memories of my Dad taking me out on a Saturday to a site above Hayden Lake, Idaho where he and my uncles were going to be framing a custom home. Site had been cleared, and there were all sorts of roughly inch and one-half diameter holes drilled into solid rock – they had to blast in order to get a foundation in!

You do have many options, however blasting can be (I have found) quite affordable. Many years ago we built a horse stall barn near Benton City, Washington. This building had a total of 84 columns and was on a rock shelf. Powder monkey came out and blasted all of them for a couple of hundred dollar bills!

There are other choices – you can rent a “ram hoe” attachment for a skid steer or backhoe (this would probably be my pick). Read more here: https://www.hansenpolebuildings.com/2016/12/attacking-pole-barn-rocks-holes/

Or, a jackhammer – I would not suggest this option for more than just a hole or two.

 

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: I am in the planning stages for a pole barn build. The building will be 50 ft wide by 40 ft deep by 16 ft high at the eaves, posts spaced at 10 ft centers. This will go on a concrete pad and I am looking into using Sturdi-Wall Plus wet set brackets. My question is in regard to the height of the posts (roughly 16 ft) and the bending moment loads (wind loads) on the side of the building. Have you designed/installed posts with this height or higher before? If so, is there a place where I can point the planning officials to that shows the calcs and what not so they can make a decision as to whether or not this type of application with my situation will work or not?

I appreciate your help! MICHAEL in UPTON

DEAR MICHAEL: Thank you for reaching out to us. We have provided fully engineered post frame buildings using these very same brackets and eave heights of 24′. Your real solution is to have your building plans done by a Registered Professional Engineer who can provide verifying calculations for all components and connections.

 

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: I have a question about the structure of your pole barns. Do you use treated lumber or non treatmented lumber? I am asking about the post that go in the ground AND the boards that touch the metal roof. I worry about the wood rotting or bugs getting in it. KRISTEN in BAY MINETTE

DEAR KRISTEN: Any roof supporting structural columns are pressure preservative treated to UC-4B per International Building Code requirements. This is a greater level of pressure treatment than you can usually find at big box stores or local lumberyards. Any other lumber used in ground contact will be treated to UC-4A and tags will reflect ‘ground contact’. Lumber in contact with steel roofing (roof purlins) are not exposed to the weather, would not typically be pressure preservative treated. We do always recommend a condensation control be used between roof steel and roof framing. The easiest, from an application standpoint, would be a factory applied to roof steel Integral Condensation Control (DripStop or CondenStop). Other alternatives would be a Radiant Reflective Barrier (we can provide this in six foot width rolls with an adhesive pull strip attached for ease of joining rolls together) or to use two inches of closed cell spray foam.

 

This entry was posted in Pole Barn Design, Pole Building How To Guides, Pole Barn Structure, Concrete, Budget, Professional Engineer, tools, Pole Barn Questions, Columns and tagged , , , , , , , , , on by .

Pitch a Roof, Up or Out, and a Site Prep Problem

Today’s Pole Barn Guru tackles reader questions about a “way to put a pitch on a flat carport roof,” when building is is cheaper to go “up or out,” and “extra” costs associated with poor site prep.

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: What is the fastest, least expensive way to put a pitch on a flat carport roof? My inclination is to use 2x material cut at 1.6 degree (3/8″/foot) across the 24′ width 16″ apart covered with 7/16″ OSB. DANIEL in YELLOW SPRINGS

DEAR DANIEL: Unless you are going to use a hot mopped or rolled EPDM roofing, you should probably be looking to do a slope of at least 3/12 for either shingles or steel roofing (steel will be least expensive and quickest). Below this roof slope shingles require added underlayment and most steel roofing paint warrantees are void. You should have a Registered Professional Engineer investigate specifics of your carport and determine a structurally sound design solution – rather than you guessing and either creating a bigger problem, or over killing and being more expensive than necessary.

 

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: My wife and I are researching pole barns with the intent of building within the next year. You’re site says it’s cheaper to build a larger footprint than it is to build up. When we built our home, our builder told us it was cheaper to build up than to build with a larger footprint. What’s the deal? JONATHAN in KENNEWICK

DEAR JONATHAN: Without comparing an exact set of variables – exact usable square footage, ceiling heights, insulation requirements, include concrete, HVAC, literally everything, I would find it difficult to predict other than they should be very, very close when all is said and done. This article goes further in depth on this vary subject: https://www.hansenpolebuildings.com/2020/02/barndominium-one-story-or-two/

 

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: Our contractor set the poles without grading the site. Now he wants to charge us $5000 more because there’s a 2′ drop. He says he needs 7 truckloads of fill dirt to make the floor level. We are building the pole barn to put our travel trailer in and now the clearance of the 12 foot door opening is in jeopardy because he has to build up the outside ramp to get to the door. What can we do? RUTHIE in SPRING HILL

Entry Door ProblemDEAR RUTHIE: To begin with your site should have been graded prior to construction starting, obviously you did not know what you did not know. Fill should not be dirt, in any case. Up to within two to six inches of bottom of your building’s splash planks should be sub base – compacted no more than every six inches. On top of this should be two to six inches of sand or sandy gravel – also compacted. Seven truckloads of fill should amount to roughly 115 yards, so if this is for proper materials, compacted, price is probably not out of line.

You could solve much of this by cutting down high spots on your site – probably at least a foot inside your building’s footprint and sloping away from your building for 10 feet outside.

 

 

This entry was posted in Rebuilding Structures, Professional Engineer, Pole Barn Questions, Pole Barn Design, Post Frame Home, Building Styles and Designs, Roofing Materials, Pole Barn Planning, Building Contractor, Trusses, Concrete and tagged , , , , , on by .

Site Prep,

Thursday’s edition will tackle three more reader questions. First up is about how level a site must be before erecting a shop, second is about pole barn homes and the many options available, and third is a question about the best method to fix an issue left by a previous builder.

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: I am planning on building a 30’x 40’ post frame shop. The ground is dirt and has about an 8” drop from east to west. How level must the site be before erecting the shop? I will out in a concrete floor after it is built. JASON in JACKSON

DEAR JASON: Personally I would get my ground as close to level before building as possible, as it is far easier to place and properly compact fill without your building being erected. Of all things being neglected in building construction, proper site preparation and compaction probably ranks close to list tops. You will want to read my series of articles beginning here: https://www.hansenpolebuildings.com/2011/11/site-preparation/.

Photos: https://hansenpolebuildings.com/uploads/polebarnquestions/0aaae906a4e86643f513e2c2c5b99bf1.jpeg

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: I saw a few pole barn homes on your website and was wondering if that is all the plans you have?  We are interested in wood siding, not metal. TRACY

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DEAR TRACY: Every post frame building Hansen Pole Buildings provides is 100% custom designed to best meet your wants and needs. We encourage our clients to design homes to best fit their lifestyle. By working from inside to out and not trying to fit what you need within a preordained box just because someone said using a “standard” site might be cheaper you can arrive at an ideal design solution. Differences in dimensions from “standard” are pennies per square foot, not dollars.

You can use the links in this article to assist with determining needed spaces, sizes and how to get expertly crafted plans and elevation drawings: https://www.hansenpolebuildings.com/2019/10/show-me-your-barndominium-plans-please/

If you find an existing plan somewhere you feel will meet your needs, we can adapt it to post frame construction and save you money. Hansen Pole Buildings can provide fully engineered post frame buildings with any type of siding or roofing materials.

 

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: I am working on finishing an apartment above a garage with framed walls/OSB and steel on the roof. The contractor who walked off the job did not put any type of vapor barrier between steel and purlins. I priced closed cell spray foam which is more than homeowner wants to pay. I was then thinking about using Visqueen on the ceiling (bottom cord of standard truss) with unfaced insulation for an airtight vapor barrier. But after more research it looks like that may not be a good option. There is ridge and soffit venting. What do you think? If not Visqueen or faced insulation do you think one inch of closed cell on the metal and batted down on the ceiling would work in Pennsylvania or would just an inch still allow sweating?

DEAR JOSHUA: Exasperating when contractors cheap out and leave clients (or client’s next builder) with a mess to have to fix.

You have only a couple of realistic options – first one is ugly, remove roof steel and place a thermal break between conditioned space and roof steel. This could be as simple as adding a Reflective Radiant Barrier. It never comes back together as well as it did originally, and when all is said and done, option number two will be less expensive.

Option two is closed cell spray foam. It really takes two inches to be an effective vapor barrier, and should run roughly two dollars per square foot of roof surface. While homeowner might not want to make this investment, he or she did not do their homework to initially be an informed buyer and if they do not solve this challenge it will be a problem forever.

 

This entry was posted in Pole Barn Design, Roofing Materials, Ventilation, Alternate Siding, Pole Barn Homes, Barndominium, Insulation, Shouse, Pole Barn Questions, Shouse and tagged , , , , , on by .

More Information, Pricing for a Kit, and Site Work and Grade Changes

Today’s Pole Barn Guru answers questions about “more information” on Hansen Pole Building’s product, pricing for a kit, as well as site work and grade changes.

Hansen Buildings TaglineDEAR POLE BARN GURU: Hey, I was wanting to see if I could get some more information on a steel house. My wife and I have 5 acres in Kings Mountain, NC and are wanting to start the home buying/ building process at the end of next year. Do you guys take care of the structure, concrete slab, flooring, electrical, grading, plumbing, well, etc? I am trying to find more information on the steel house process and how I can go about getting started. Looking forward to hearing back from you. SAWYER in KINGS MOUNTAIN

DEAR SAWYER: Thank you for your interest in a new Hansen Pole Building. Here is a great resource to get you started: https://www.hansenpolebuildings.com/2019/10/show-me-your-barndominium-plans-please/

Our goal is to provide you with the best possible building value and to help you avoid making crucial mistakes you will regret forever. We take care of custom design and structural aspects of your home along with delivery to your site. We include detailed step-by-step assembly instructions for you or your builder as well as unlimited free Technical Support from people who have actually built buildings.

Sign up for our every weekday blogs, friend us on Facebook, or give us a call at 1(866)200-9657.

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: I have seen your kits available other places so I decided to go to you directly. Where do I find pricing for 48 ft. x 60 ft. x 20 ft. Wood Garage Kit without Floor. LEAMARIE in NEW RICHMOND

DEAR LEAMARIE: Your quickest way to obtain pricing on this (or any dimension post frame building) is to call 1(866)200-9657 and ask to speak with a Hansen Pole Buildings’ Designer.

 

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: I live on the side of the mountain and planning on building a 36×40 shop, I have to do a little of grade work and may need to bring in some pit fill. Wondering if these pole barn kits will work for me? My plan is to have a concrete slab… was thinking of a Thickened edge slab because of my concern of frost heaving of a floating slab, does a pole barn make sense in my situation? Or should I just do a stick frame… DAVE in BOZEMAN

DEAR DAVE: Beautiful area – I spent a year in Bozeman when I was studying Architecture.

There have been many questions recently on dealing with grade change and fill…..all clear, level sites must be used up!


Regardless of what building type you are going to do, here is some information on site preparation, fill and compaction: https://www.hansenpolebuildings.com/2011/11/soil-compaction-how-to/.

Thickening your slab’s edge is probably not going to be a solution for frost heave. Here is some further reading on frost heave: https://www.hansenpolebuildings.com/2011/10/pole-building-structure-what-causes-frost-heaves/.

Post frame (pole) building construction is going to be easiest and most cost effective design solution.

This entry was posted in Pole Barn Planning, Pole Barn Homes, Barndominium, Pole Barn Questions, Pole Building How To Guides and tagged , , , , on by .

Proper Foundation and Slab, Two-Story Buildings, and Door Parts

Proper Foundation and Slab, Two-Story Buildings, and Door Parts

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: Dear Sir, I read the details of pouring a concrete slab after building the barn. I live in Montana with some pretty cold winters. If I were laying a slab for a conventional stick built structure i would be required to dig footings 48” deep all around the perimeter. What should I do if I am building a pole barn? While I may supply low level background heat I would like a construction that does not require it to resist Montana winters.
Regards, DEREK in KALISPELL

DEAR DEREK: Regardless of the type of construction used, the success or lack thereof for your slab is going to come from what you do underneath it, as well as grading the site properly to keep water from pooling below it.

Follow along first by reading my series of articles devoted to site preparation which begins with: https://www.hansenpolebuildings.com/2011/11/site-preparation/.

You will want to have your building site graded so as there is a 5% slope away from the building, when completed.

Now the fun part – protecting your building itself. I’ve become an advocate for Frost-Protected Shallow Foundations. Here are a couple of articles which should get you heading in the right direction: https://www.hansenpolebuildings.com/2016/11/frost-protected-shallow-foundations/

and https://www.hansenpolebuildings.com/2017/09/post-frame-frost-walls/.

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: Do you offer 30 x 40 2 story apartment/garages?? ROB in ALPINE

About Hansen BuildingsDEAR ROB: We offer any dimension of footprint you desire, not just 30 foot width by 40 feet long and would encourage you to look at what works best for you in an internal layout, then create the exterior dimensions which best fit your interior needs. Two and even three full or partial stories can easily be done with post frame construction and if your zoning allows the overall height and you are willing to add sprinklers, you could go four stories.

Your mixed use will probably result in having to at least one-hour fire separate the apartment from the garage. This could include having to protect the stairs, if they are interior, as well as to provide clear protection all the way to the outside world. A discussion with your local planning and zoning friends could provide you with added insights.

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: Do you have available, either metal or wood, a barn door and hardware for an opening 8′ high and 5′ wide, to be placed within a screen porch (the entrance to the garage)? TRISH in WIMBERLEY

DEAR TRISH: Thank you for your interest. Due to shipping challenges, we now only provide barn doors along with the investment into a complete post frame building kit. You might try contacting the ProDesk at your local The Home Depot®.

 

 

 


This entry was posted in Footings, Pole Barn Homes, Workshop Buildings, Sliding Doors, Pole Barn Questions and tagged , , , , , , on by .

Condensation Control, Home Plans, and Grade Changes!

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: If I put double bubble under metal on roof for condensation control, then insulate bottom chord of trusses with white vinyl faced insulation , will this create a problem if I ventilate attic space ? Thanks. SCOTT in DUNLAP

DEAR SCOTT: You actually have several things going on here. First, single bubble reflective radiant barrier will do everything double bubble will, at a far lesser investment. The difference in the minimal R value is a fraction of one! Your building ceiling should not have an additional vapor barrier, you want the moisture from inside the building to be able to migrate through into the ventilated attic space. Blowing in an appropriate thickness of fiberglass or cellulose insulation will be far more effective, probably less expensive and will allow the moisture through. Make sure to have adequate intake at the eaves and exhaust at the ridge to be able to properly vent the dead attic space.

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: Hello!

Do you all also finish the interior of pole barns if we want it to be a home or would I contract that separately?

Thanks! TIFFANY

DEAR TIFFANY: Thank you for your interest in a new Hansen Pole Building. We provide the custom designed plans, materials delivered to your site and assembly instructions for the shell and load supporting portions of your new building only. Any interior walls and/or interior wall finishes would be up to you to contract for.

 

 

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: Can I build a pole building home in the side of a hill, where the back will be below grade and the front above. RICK in CLEAR LAKE

Post Frame HomeDEAR RICK: Most certainly you can. I have a post frame building on the back of our property outside of Spokane, Washington. The site has 12 feet of grade change across the 40 foot width. After excavating the area where the building would be placed to level, ICF blocks were placed 12 feet high along the southern wall, stepping down with the slope on the east wall, with the other two walls being “daylight” and utilizing traditional columns embedded in the ground. You can read more about my building here: https://www.hansenpolebuildings.com/2013/06/garage/

 

This entry was posted in Uncategorized and tagged , , , , on by .

Commercial Girts Best for Drywall, Site Prep, and Condensation

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: I’m considering a pole barn for my residence but had a question about the girt placement between posts. I read in the FAQ section that they are placed like shelves between posts. Would it be possible to mount drywall directly to these for interior walls without additional bracing or building of interior wall frames? I’m trying to avoid framing an entire building within a building, it seems pointless and not cost effective. If I need to frame every interior wall to hold drywall and insulation, I can simply build a standard stick frame house. VAN in INDEPENDENCE

Installing Drywall on CeilingDEAR VAN: Bookshelf girts for insulation (e.g. Commercial Girts) is a quick and easy way to create a deep insulation cavity as well as providing the framing for your interior GWB (Gypsum Wall Board). You will want to confirm your new post frame building frame is stiff enough to prevent undue deflection from cracking the GWB joints.

Learn more about commercial girts here: https://www.hansenpolebuildings.com/2011/09/commercial-girts-what-are-they/.

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: I have property in an area that floods from time to time. For example, can a monitor barn (approx. 25×50). with side sheds be built. The idea I have is the side sheds serving as porches and under the barn would be a drive through area. there is already a modular home built in the area that is elevated about 4 ft. off the ground and they have had no problem . Thanks, MIKE in MOLINA

DEAR MIKE: You can build any sort of post frame building on your site which will be allowable under the limitations of your Planning Department. As to dealing with the flood issues, you should have your property elevations determined by a surveyor, and the site where the building will be constructed can then be built up so the floor will be above the flood plain level.

 

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: I recently purchased several 4’x50′ reflectix double bubble foil rolls. I’ve put up a brand new 30×56 post frame metal building and was going to use this product to keep the metal roof and walls from condensating not to mention I was hoping it would help keep some heat in during the winter and heat out during the summer until I truly insulate the inside. My question is, for ease of installation on my metal roof panels, is it acceptable to put the foil on the underside of the 2×6 roof joists instead of sandwiching it between the roof joists and metal? There will be no roof venting due to leaving the trusses and attic space exposed. My only real concern is that it could condensate worse installing it this way. Also I will not be continually heating the building. Only on occasion with a propane heater while I’m working. I’m not real savvy when it comes to insulation and condensation control so any advice would be appreciated. Thanks in advance! Brandon

DEAR BRANDON: While it would be easy to install the steel roofing without having to place the reflective radiant barrier between the roof purlins and the roof steel, it is going to be the easiest method to limit condensation issues, given the product you have invested in. Hopefully you have gotten the double bubble with a tab along one side and an adhesive pull strip, otherwise you will have to tape all of the seams as you work your way along the roof.

Could you place it on the underside of the purlins? Yes, however in order to work as an effective condensation control, it has to be absolutely tightly sealed against any protruding framing members. Remember the time you saved on installing the roof steel? You just ate it all up.

If you have not yet ordered your steel roofing you could resell the reflective radiant barrier online and order steel with I.C.C. (Integral Condensation Control) attached (see the article and video here: https://www.hansenpolebuildings.com/2017/03/integral-condensation-control/).

 

 

This entry was posted in Uncategorized, Insulation, Steel Roofing & Siding, Building Interior, Pole Barn Homes and tagged , , , , , on by .
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