Tag Archives: pole barn house

Extreme Efforts to Add Post Frame to House

Extreme Efforts to Match Post Frame to House

Reader JOSH from POST FALLS and I have previously communicated. He is doing what I refer to a piecemealing – putting together his own building by making repeated trips to the local lumber yard (learn more about piecemealing here: https://www.hansenpolebuildings.com/2014/03/diy-pole-building/.

Josh’s new post frame garage is adjacent to his home and he wants things to match up.

Josh writes:Construction Manual

“Thanks so much for your offer for help. The knowledge of other people’s questions on your site is a great resource. I’ll buy my next pole structure kit from you for sure.

Quick question. I have an 18″ overhang with 2×8 purlins and truss top members. My pole garage is next to my house and will be matching the exterior of the house. The varge rafter and fascia on the house are 2×6.  It looks like I can just trim the bottom off on the fascia side, but what is the recommended way to match the gable end to the house if the purlins on the garage are 2×8 instead of 2×6?

Also are the varge rafter and the facscia both 1×6? or 2×6?

P.S. I noticed you used grok in one of your answers to a question. Haha, first use of grok in a non-technical setting I’ve seen. You must have a technical background.”

Mike the Pole Barn Guru Writes:

My mission is to be informative and entertaining – if grok got a chuckle from you, then all is good! I also try to throw out some occasional words most people do not use every day, with the hopes it will expand the vocabulary of some.

Unless your pole garage is attached to your house, frankly no one except you or I would ever notice the fascias are not the same dimension. People just are not finely attuned to details such as these. If it is really important to you, you could cut the overhanging portion of the purlins down to 5-1/2″ by ripping a chunk off from the overhanging portion, without it negatively affecting the structural ability of the purlins to carry the load. Your Building Department may require a letter from the engineer who designed your building on this one, however.

I would go with two inch nominal material for both the varges and fascias – they will be far straighter and will tend not to wave as much between supports.

 

 

Barn Doors, Freight, and Barndomonium!

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: I would like to see if there is a product out there for the back of my barn. My barn is set up with two stall doors. The back door allows the horses to go into their pastures 24/7. I currently have tin on wooden doors and this cuts them up occasionally. Is there anything I can put on there besides tin? Any recommendations would be appreciated. DEBBIE in WILLARDS
Animal Confinement BuildingDEAR DEBBIE: Your best solution for covering the doors is “tin” (actually it is steel), as it will be both the most affordable and most durable. If your horses are getting cut by it, it means the steel was improperly installed. Any edges of the steel should be tucked neatly into J Channel trims, which will protect your horses from snagging an edge. Take a color photo of the door(s) along with the measurements of the door to the Pro Desk at your local The Home Depot® and they should be able to assist you in getting the needed parts.

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: How much is shipping for a building to Michigan? DON in RICHMOND

DEAR DON: In the continental United States (a.k.a. the lower 48) shipping to your accessible site is always included in the basic price, other than if a toll ferry is involved. In those cases, the actual ferry charges will be added as incurred.

 

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: Hi, my husband and I are looking I to purchasing a small piece of land and want to build a pole barn home on it. I’m envisioning 4 bed upstairs with 2 bath and a loft area and on the main floor a master bed with bath , kitchen/dining, great room at least 3 car garage . So you have anything that would be close to what I’m thinking? KELLI in NEW BADEN

Engineer sealed pole barnDEAR KELLI: All Hansen Pole Buildings’ post frame buildings are custom designed to best meet with the needs of our clients, so in answer to your question – yes. We do not include the design of your interior rooms, however. Our specialty is the design and provision of structural members, which would include the building shell, and raised wood floors (including over crawl spaces and basements, second or third floors, lofts and mezzanines), as well as stairs.

Browse on line and look for a room layout which would meet with your needs and chances are excellent we can design the structure which will fit it.

 

Hangar to House?

This article was triggered by an article I read recently by Karen L. Chandler at www.readingeagle.com in regards to a post frame building in Perry County, PA., excerpted below:

In other business, attorney Zachary A. Morey of Hoffert & Konis PC of Reading asked the supervisors to consider allowing an addition to Peter Lombardi’s pole building on Skyline Drive. The proposed addition would be used as a residence by Lombardi’s father.

Body noted the pole building was previously used as an airplane hangar, but Morey said it was now used for storage and as a part-time residence.

 Supervisors Chairman Dean A. Adam said the pole building was never intended to be a residence and questioned why Lombardi could not build a house on the site.

 “It was not disclosed to us what he’s doing until he did it. He’s defrauding us.” Adam said, adding that the property was not assessed as a residence for tax purposes.

Morey said Lombardi had gotten an occupancy permit for the building in 2001, but Shollenberger said if the building is permitted as a hangar, it could not be converted to residential use.

 Body asked Morey to provide documentation confirming the tax assessment on the property is accurate and said the property should be inspected to ensure it is appropriate for a dwelling before an addition is approved.”

Unless the hangar was to be used commercially, it is most likely designed at a Risk Occupancy I building (and probably constructed without engineered plans). Residences require a Risk Occupancy II which has more stringent requirements for resisting climactic loads.

There are more than good chances the hangar was not designed with trusses capable of supporting a significant ceiling load (like gypsum wallboard) or walls stiff enough to support drywall without cracking.

Structurally, albeit with some possible modification, a RDP (Registered Design Professional – architect or engineer) could review the original plans and make a determination as to the repairs necessary to properly upgrade the building. This will probably also involve acquiring an engineered truss repair from the truss manufacturer. If a dead attic space is created, then ventilation must be attended to. Energy codes must also be addressed. It is possible these fixes could involve some significant expenses.

Now this does not even begin to tackle the question of whether or not the property happens to be residentially zoned.

How can you avoid these challenges with your new post frame building?

Design appropriately as a Risk Category II building, framed ready for sheetrocked walls and ceiling, with the appropriate ventilation and provisions to be insulated. The minor up front investment makes this route the road to race down!

Barn Doors? Houses? Materials!

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: Where can I find barn doors, sliding steel style? They have no internet presence, or else there is a secret name for them. Thank you! BONNY in FRANKFORT

DEAR BONNY: If you are in search of a steel covered, metal framed sliding door (which is what the huge majority of sliding doors are) you are not finding them on the internet because they are components which are put together for the door frame and then the steel siding is added.

We provide literally thousands of these doors a year, however they are only available with the investment into a complete post frame (pole) building kit package, due to the logistics of avoiding shipping damage.

If you are looking for just the door, my recommendation would be to stop at the Pro Desk of your local The Home Depot®. They should be able to fix you up with everything you will need for successful completion of your sliding steel barn door.

 

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: Looking 1700 sq ft 2 bedroom pole barn house great room 1 bedroom 2 floor 2 full baths. DAVE in BELLVILLE

DEAR DAVE: Post frame (pole barn) buildings make for fabulous homes, as they are affordable, can easily be constructed by the home owner, go up quickly and offer a tremendous degree of flexibility.

In the case of Hansen Pole Buildings, we take care of the perimeter structural design, provide all of the engineered building plans for the shell (along with assembly instructions) and deliver the materials to your jobsite. Once the building shell has been completed, you are then free to place interior walls wherever will best meet your needs.

You can find out more about barndominiums here: https://www.hansenpolebuildings.com/2016/04/the-rise-of-the-barndominium/.

 

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: I recently started erecting the pole barn material you had supplied and found that the gable posts aren’t long enough for the design. The drawings call for the posts to be set in the ground at 40″ and then rise up to support the trusses 11 feet above grade. That would require a minimum of 14′-4″ posts. The posts that were delivered are 14′-0″. In order to proceed with the project I need 16′-0″ posts. How should I proceed? Ideally I will be reimbursed for the new posts that I purchase today since I need them to continue progress on the building. Please advise. PETER in RHINEBECK

Hansen Buildings Construction ManualDEAR PETER: Thank you for being on top of inventory. We so appreciate clients who inventory promptly and report any discrepancies immediately through their online login. Although 16 foot long columns were ordered, it appears whoever pulled the order in the lumberyard did not look very closely at their tape measure.

To aid in speeding replacement, please provide a photo showing the columns along with a tape measure which confirms the incorrect length. The lumberyard should be able to have the corrected materials pulled within hours and delivery and swap out done immediately following.

 

 

How Deep Should Pole Barn Holes Be?

Welcome to Ask the Pole Barn Guru – where you can ask questions about building topics, with answers posted on Mondays.  With many questions to answer, please be patient to watch for yours to come up on a future Monday segment.  If you want a quick answer, please be sure to answer with a “reply-able” email address.

Email all questions to: PoleBarnGuru@HansenPoleBuildings.com

ask-the-guruDEAR POLE BARN GURU: I am concerned that my plans might not have my pole barn holes going deep enough. The person I have hired to drill the holes for me has had a couple bad experiences with ‘frost heaves’ in our area, specifically when he didn’t go at least 4 feet down. My plans call for a 42″ depth for the pole barn holes, and the post going down only 34″. I would like to go down as far as possible with my posts, but obviously don’t want to be short on the top. Can you please take a look at my plans, and tell me what my maximum post depth would be? Thank you. JOE IN TAYLORS FALLS

DEAR JOE: Frost heaving is certainly a valid concern in areas of the country where deep freezing can be an issue. The requirements for frost depth are one of the items we have every client address, when they have their Building Code and load information verified by their Building Department prior to ordering their new Hansen Pole Building kit package.

I’ve written extensively on frost heave, as well as what to do, or not to do here: https://www.hansenpolebuildings.com/2013/11/frost-heave/

For your state, Minnesota, the Minnesota Department of Labor and Industry has available a frost depth map: https://www.dli.mn.gov/ccld/pdf/bc_map_frost_depth.pdf

SquareFoot™ concrete footing forms has a frost depth map for the United States: https://soundfootings.com/pdf/US_Map_Frost_DepthAVG.pdf

In your particular case, with a perfectly level site, you could have the pole barn holes as deep as 56″, which places the bottom of the columns at 48″ below grade. The key word being “perfectly level”. It is acceptable to dig the holes deeper yet, and increasing the depth of concrete below the column.

Mike the Pole Barn Guru

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: I have a pole barn built in 1971 by Moriarty. My FRP Skylight has deteriorated and rotted off do I have any options other than replacing the whole roof, no one seems to be able to match the rib pattern.

Thank you GARY IN RIDGEVILLE

DEAR GARY:

Over the years there has been a consolidation of steel roofing and siding profiles, to the benefit of all involved except those who have older buildings with more unique rib patterns (like yours may very well be). Skylights (whether FRP or Polycarbonate) should really be avoided in the roof plane as they are not designed to withstand horizontal wind loads.

Some choices (other than entirely replacing the roof) – replace the areas of FRP with new steel panels which have the same net width coverage. Obviously the colors will not match, so you may consider using an entirely different color as an accent panel. Or, send us photos and measurements which will clearly delineate all dimensions. While we cannot recommend this as a structural solution, if our polycarbonate manufacturer can match it – it does afford a solution.

For more reading about old skylights: https://www.hansenpolebuildings.com/2014/09/skylights-2/

Mike the Pole Barn Guru

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: Hello,

My husband and I are considering on building a pole barn house. The one question we currently have is: How would the house stand up to our Canadian weather? We live in Saskatchewan where the weather can drop to -55c in the winter. Thanks TRINITY IN TISDALE

DEAR TRINITY: Good for you and your husband for considering a pole barn house. Regardless of whether your weather is extreme cold or heat, post frame (pole) building construction can prove to be very energy efficient. Roof systems can be created to allow for R-60 or greater insulation depths and wall cavities can be designed to meet any desired insulation thickness.

In most cases wall and roof systems can be designed to minimize thermal bridging.

Mike the Pole Barn Guru

Moving Sliding Doors to Inside of Building

Welcome to Ask the Pole Barn Guru – where you can ask questions about building topics, with answers posted on Mondays.  With many questions to answer, please be patient to watch for yours to come up on a future Monday segment.  If you want a quick answer, please be sure to answer with a “reply-able” email address.

Email all questions to: PoleBarnGuru@HansenPoleBuildings.com

Pole Barn Guru BlogDEAR POLE BARN GURU: Hello, we have a problem with our sliding barn doors hanging up on the siding and getting froze into the ice/snow or stuck in mud. Is there any reason to not relocate them inside the barn? Our barn has a concrete floor but the outside approach is dirt and grass. Moving the track and (2) doors inside would prevent snow and mud from interfering with opening and seems to be a win win. We have just never seen this done before. Thanks for your time! BRANDONN IN MUSKEGON

DEAR BRANDONN: Your situation is a prime example of why I try to discourage the use of sliding doors in snow country. In most instances sectional overhead doors are a much better design solution.

Most clients with sliding doors do not want to mount them on the inside because they do not want to sacrifice the wall space. Nothing can be hung or placed against the interior of the wall in the direction the door (or doors) slide.

In many instances exterior sliding doors can be taller than interior sliding doors, as the interior doors must hang below the bottom chord of the trusses. This may be an issue in your case.

As far as relocating – if it was my own building I would want to re-side this wall, to eliminate the slot in the siding where the track board currently resides. Most of the balance of the expense (or time) will come from labor. But yes, you can move them, with the above considerations in mind.

Mike the Pole Barn Guru

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: How much a square foot for a horse area that is 50’wx128’Lx14′ eave height, metal painted siding and white metal roof with an 8×10, 10×10 and 12×16 roll up metal insulated doors with 2 man doors, 8-4’x6′ sliding double pane windows, and an 8×8 tack room? JOHN IN GARDEN CITY

DEAR JOHN: Thank you very much for your interest in a new Hansen Pole Building. While we appreciate you having worked out so many of the dimensional details, as well as doors and windows, it is always best to discuss your exact building needs with one of our Building Designers at (866)200-9657. Every quote is free, and your Building Designer will contact you as much – or as little as you wish.

Your request for a tack room leads me to believe some portion of this building may eventually have some stalls in it. If so, we can perhaps make some suggestions as to size and locations which would give you the most bang for your investment.

I always encourage horse enthusiasts to read through some of the most relevant articles on equestrian facilities, prior to getting ideas “set in stone”.

Here are a few:

Arenas: https://www.hansenpolebuildings.com/2012/07/the-perfect-indoor-riding-arena/

Stalls: https://www.hansenpolebuildings.com/2011/12/horse-stalls/

Aisleways: https://www.hansenpolebuildings.com/2011/12/horse-aisleway/

Ventilation: https://www.hansenpolebuildings.com/2012/11/horse-barn-ventilation/

Mike the Pole Barn Guru

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: Could you tell me how tall are the side walls on project 04-0509 please? If I wanted to build a combo workshop and home, a home with two floors, how tall of a side wall do you recommend? If I got a quote from you for 16′ tall building, 60 x 40.  How much of a difference is it to change it to 18′ side walls.  Or can I get two floors for my house out of a sixteen footer?  Please advise. Thank you. PAUL IN MECHANICSBURG

DEAR PAUL: The walls on Project 04-0509 are 18 feet tall, which is the bare minimum needed to get two full eight foot tall ceilings. You need to account for the thickness of a nominal four inch thick concrete slab, the thickness of the floor system (usually around a foot) and the thickness of the roof system (always at least six inches). In order to get the full thickness of attic insulation from wall to wall, I recommend using raised heel trusses (read more here: https://www.hansenpolebuildings.com/blog/2012/07/raised-heel-trusses/), which means you will generally need to add yet another foot to the eave height.

Keep in mind – fire separation requirements between mixed uses (shop and living areas), which will entail a minimum of one-hour fire resistance.

Mike the Pole Barn Guru

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: How much does a pole barn materials weigh? 30×40 x12 DONALD IN LIBERTY

DEAR DONALD: Obviously the features of any given building will change the weight. For the dimensions you have mentioned, with average features, expect it to weigh in at about 8,000 pounds.

Mike the Pole Barn Guru

Residential Pole Barns

Common Sense – It Isn’t Common Any More

As reported in the West Frankfort, Illinois Daily American, in an article posted November 12, 2014 by Leigh M. Caldwell:

“The much-discussed ordinance establishing codes for mobile homes, modular homes, portable buildings and pole barns will go back before city commissioners tonight for a vote.

West Frankfort’s Planning Commission has drafted a couple of different versions of the ordinance over the past few months, garnering much discussion and public comment.

As for portable buildings and pole barns, the proposed ordinance would ban them from being used as residences. Anyone wanting to build a so-called pole barn house would have to meet the requirements for residential structures.”

residential-homeFor the benefit of the unenlightened in West Frankfort (or anywhere else in the United States), “pole barns” are actually more technically “post frame buildings” and their construction is covered as Code Conforming in the International Codes.

It could be unlawful, as well as possibly unethical, for a jurisdiction to deny a Code conforming structural building system. However, as best I have been able to ascertain, to place limitations upon types of roofing and/or siding as well as even colors is certainly within a jurisdiction’s area of control.

Now if you are one who is faced with these types of limitations – keep in mind the folks who have enacted them were either elected by you, or appointed to positions by the folks you elected!

Regardless of the type of building system, whether it be stick framed (stud walls), masonry, concrete, straw bale, or yes – even pole barns – if it falls under residential pole barns, the International Residential Code (IRC) requirements must be adhered to.

The September 2014 Rural Builder Magazine recently focused upon residential pole barns, including the cover story which was authored by yours truly! To read more visit: https://www.constructionmagnet.com/post-frame-technique/post-frame-comes-home-part-i-brave-new-world-of-the-pole-barn-house