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Sliding Door Parts, Pole Shapes, and Roof Pitch for Snow Loads

This Wednesday the Pole Barn Guru answers reader questions about a possible source of replacement sliding door parts, the shape of poles for pole buildings, and whether or not a 2/12 roof pitch can handle the Minnesota snow loads.

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: Hi! I have a Cleary Pole Barn with concrete floor and main doors are dual sliding doors. The single piece center bottom guide plate that the doors close into (keeps them together) has gradually worked its way off the 6×6 that is sunk into the ground and is all mangled up and I am trying to find a suitable replacement. Any thoughts as to where I can go to look at options? Thank you. BILL in TRENTON

DEAR BILL: Try reaching out to Plyco (https://www.plyco.com/slide-doors/sliding-door-components). If they will not sell you one direct, they should be able to direct you to a vendor near you.

 

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: What are the poles shaped like? For instance 6×6 square (?cut corners like landscape or true square 6×6″)? I’m having a Drafting company draw up a gable porch (attached to house) to replace metal carport overhang. 3-Gable style 3-stall carport 26’x20′ and matchjbg 3-gable 3-stall utility boat/Rv port, center stall (gable) is raised 36’x24′. They are what I call glorified pole barns. I’m already obligated for the engineering @$4k. Porch is on 8×8 cedar posts, 6×4 beams. Carports using 6×6, 6×4 beams that Extend beyond eve w/curved end like a pergalo look (Tuscan). Metal roof. Porch will probably be planked before plywood layer, but also quoting vinyl ceiling, attaches to plywood after roof. I’m looking for builder that can handle Big beams. Told the Amish or Mennonites are best in this area – they knows the ropes. Have a Mill supplier located only 40min away, but taking bids. Nokomis, build in 2-3mo, time to get permits issued. DEBBI in NOKOMIS

DEAR DEBBI: In our instance, columns would typically be rectangular 4-1/8″ x 5-1/8″ as we use only glu-lam columns for structural roof supports. It is a shame you invested $4k in engineering, as we include engineer sealed structural plans with every building our clients invest in – even if you have already paid for it elsewhere (rarely do outside engineers design to our rigid standards of quality).

 

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: I have found and customized single sloped barndominium house plan that is 96′ x 34′ (living area 49×34, garage 45×35) with a 10′ covered rear porch that extends from the roof. The plan was a generic plan i found online that calls for a 2:12 roof pitch. My question is…Would this 2:12 pitch at this width (35′) work for a home in Central MN considering the snow loads? There is a bearing wall that will run the length of living area at 15′, but not in the garage. ROBERT in SAUK RAPIDS

DEAR ROBERT: Whether pitched or single sloped, we can engineer a clearspan roof system capable of supporting Central Minnesota’s snow loads across 35 feet. I normally encourage clients to look at a minimum of a 2.5/12 roof slope, as flatter slopes void paint warranties.

 

 

 

This entry was posted in Lumber, Pole Barn Questions, Columns, Pole Barn Design, Pole Barn Homes, Building Styles and Designs, Building Department, Pole Barn Planning, Sliding Doors, Trusses, single slope, Barndominium, Building Interior, Professional Engineer and tagged , , , , , , , on by .

Air Intake, Sliding Door Trolleys, and Footing Costs

This Thursday is another bonus ” ask the Guru” answering questions about proper air intake with no overhangs, replacing sliding door trolleys, and most cost effective footing solution.

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: I am in preliminary stages of designing a post-frame building, that will serve a multitude of functions such as a home gym, work-shop, and area to host family parties. It is a 30′ x 76′ x 20′ tall, with 2 fully enclosed leans 64′ long on each side that span out 16′. I really like Scandinavian style, which utilizes no overhang. My main concern is how to allow for proper air intake if I do zero over-hang since there will not any soffit. Curious for your thoughts. Would you recommend against ‘zero over-hang’? Or do you think there is some work-around for air intake and gutter attachment? Hoping for a quick answer! Thanks in advance : ) SHANE in HARTLAND

DEAR SHANE: In my humble opinion – I would personally go without doors, before I would go without overhangs. For me it is about looks (no overhangs look too industrial for my tastes), functionality (besides being a perfect location for air intake, they do keep your walls much cleaner, provide protection of windows from summer sun, pushes rainfall/snow away from base of building). You can meet Code requirements for air intake via gable vents, however they do not afford nearly as even airflow as to eave intake vents combined with a vented ridge. Gutters can be hung off from eave struts (aka eave girt or eave purlin), however it does increase possibilities of having water back up into one’s wall if an ice dam were to occur.

 

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: I have a quonset with (2) 15’x14′ sliding doors with 4 cannonball style rollers each that need to be replaced. I’m thinking I’ll have to remove the doors, but what is the best way to do this? CODY in MAYNARD

DEAR CODY: If these are one piece doors and not bi-parting, you can remove any end stops and slide door out of rail on one end, replace trolley, then repeat in opposite direction. If doors are bi-parting, you will need to remove doors to replace trolleys (and have plenty of help, as doors will be unwieldy).

 

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: I been debating on what foundation to go with. I’m in Texas 1.5 hours west of Houston. I noticed some going with piers and slab or the wall footing with slab. It’s going to be a post frame house. Possibly shingle roof. What is the best foundation system that will not fail? ANGEL in SEALY

Pole FootingDEAR ANGEL: Your strongest and most affordable foundation will be to use true glulaminated columns, embedded in ground. Regardless of what you pick, it will only be as good as ground it is placed upon. A well prepared site, where clays and organic materials have been removed and proper fill has been placed and compacted every six inches, will greatly improve your chances of having a solid foundation. I would encourage you to consider a steel roof, as shingles have a very short life span (read more here: https://www.hansenpolebuildings.com/2018/10/ask-the-builder/.

This entry was posted in Building Overhangs, Pole Barn Planning, Pole Barn Homes, Ventilation, Pole Barn Heating, Concrete, Footings, Post Frame Home, Budget, Barndominium, Lumber, Professional Engineer, floorplans, Insulation, Pole Barn Questions, Columns, Pole Barn Design and tagged , , , , , , , on by .

Secure Doors, Soffits, Wind, and Sliding Door Tracks

This Wednesday the Pole Barn Guru answers reader questions about a secure replacement for sliding doors, soffit kits, a singular concern of wind, and replacing tracks for a sliding door.

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: I need to replace two 9.5 ft wide by 8 feet high sliding doors on my pole barn. The current doors are a wood box frame with a piece of siding. I am looking for something secure so I can keep tools and stuff inside. I also need help with a soffit question. Is there a steel/aluminum facing and soffit kit that I can use to make this easier without much cutting and metal bending work? CHRISTOPHER in GROVE CITY

DEAR CHRISTOPHER: If you are looking for security you should consider upgrading to sectional steel overhead doors. Sliding doors are not secure and do not seal tightly (as you have probably determined).

Metal soffit panels are available in 12′ lengths, both vented and unvented, they will need to be cut to width of your overhang, however properly installed, both cut edges will be covered by steel trim. Fascia trims are manufactured as an “L” with long vertical leg being height of your building’s fascia board plus 1/2″ for soffit thickness. Shorter leg will be 1-1/2″ with a hem. This will cover cut ends of your soffit panels as well as any exposed fasteners. Both soffit and fascia are available in a plethora of colors.

 

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: My only concern is wind…

DAVID in SYRACUSE

DEAR DAVID: We are concerned about all climactic conditions, with every building we provide. This is one of many reasons we made a determination long ago to only provide fully engineered buildings – as it is an assurance to our clients every component and connection has been reviewed for structural adequacy.

Keep in mind, Building Code load requirements are bare minimums and are no guarantee buildings will not suffer severe damage, if loaded to maximum design loads. Codes are designed to protect human life, not necessarily to keep buildings standing usefully. I would encourage you to explore design wind speeds greater than Code minimums, as often they come with very small extra investments. We can design and have engineered buildings capable of surviving EF-3 tornadoes (wind speeds up to and including 208 mph).

Important with any design for wind, is an understanding of wind exposure. For extended reading, please visit: https://www.hansenpolebuildings.com/2012/03/wind-exposure-confusion/

 

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: Have a 1970 Quonset hut on our property and the doors are the sliding doors. The bottom track for the doors are all bent and beat up that the beginning of the tracks and the doors won’t stay on their tracks anymore. The length of the existing tracks are 101.5 inches – and I need replacement guides/tracks so the doors will actually stay on the tracks when it gets windy and stop popping off at the bent end. Where does one acquire those replacement track/guides for the existing huge sliding doors. Thank you. DAWN in HARRINGTON

DEAR DAWN: You have discovered why ‘modern’ sliding doors use a bottom door girt with a slot, where as door slides open, a building mounted guide keeps doors tight to your wall. My best recommendation would be to have a machine shop fabricate up new bottom tracks – if you only have to replace them once every 50 years or so, it would prove to be a sound investment.

This entry was posted in Professional Engineer, Sliding Doors, Pole Barn Questions, Overhead Doors, Pole Barn Design, Building Overhangs, Pole Barn Planning and tagged , , , , , on by .

A Building Addition, A “Coverup,” and Advice for an Acquired Building

Today the Pole Barn Guru answers reader questions about adding on to an existing pole barn with use of 24″ oc trusses, covering old wooden sliding doors with steel, and advice regarding erecting an acquired Cuckler steel building.

About Hansen BuildingsDEAR POLE BARN GURU: Trying to plan on a 36’x80’x12′ addition to an existing 30’x40’x10′ pole barn. This new barn will be insulated with an insulated ceiling and have a shingled roof to match my existing barn. Because I am not planning on a steel roof and instead, OSB sheeting and asphalt shingles and because I am needing an insulated ceiling I do not believe it makes sense to install double trusses at 12′ apart. I have no need for roof purlins and ceiling joists if I put single trusses at 24″ O.C. The material & labor costs to install purlins & ceiling joist must out-weigh the cost saving of having 4 less roof trusses per 12′ span. JOE in FENNVILLE

DEAR JOE: Thank you for your interest in a new Hansen Pole Building. We certainly can design your building with trusses placed two foot on center on top of truss carriers (headers) between columns. Your Building Designer will be reaching out to you shortly.

 

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: I have an old wood barn that I overlapped with metal. I completely redid the double sliding doors which are 6 feet wide by 12 feet tall. They are 2×4 wood frames that I plan to place metal on top of. I am having a very difficult time finding out how to trim the doors so none of the wood is exposed on the outside face. I have seen what is called F channel, but is it made to fit dimensional lumber as in 1.5 inches? JEFF in OWNESBORO

Pole Building ShopDEAR JEFF: I would have ditched lumber frames for prepainted metal frames and been done with it, plus metal will never twist and warp like wood and your door frame would be significantly lighter (not too late to regroup). Still not convinced? Any steel roofing and siding roll former can bend trim to match any dimensions, so you can have created exactly what you are looking for.

 

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: When we purchased our land, we acquired an old cuckler steel clearspan building we would like to erect as our garage. The steel is in great shape and will make an awesome garage with some work. All we have are the trusses, side beams and z purlins so I will be supplying new 2×10 roof joists, metal roofing and siding. I’ve got a hardware list put together with all new grade 8 bolts, some 1″, and I’m fine with assembly but we need some engineering plan to be able to get a building permit. How can we go about reverse engineer this enough to give us what we need to apply for a permit? Also the sidewalls on this building are 8′ and we are trying to figure out if we want to raise the sidewall, what is the best way to do that?

Building info: model C20 Rigid frame 40×60

We found an old Cuckler building guidebook. We have the building on page 12 and 13. (see attached) TAMI in STEAMBOAT SPRINGS

DEAR TAMI: Your attachment did not make it, but no worries. I am going to connect you with Hansen Pole Buildings’ primary third party engineer – if it can be made to work, he can do it. I will caution you, Building Codes and accepted engineering practice have changed dramatically since this old Cuckler Building was designed. It is possible you own nothing more than a pile of recycling. Best of luck to you.

 

 

 

 

This entry was posted in Pole Barn Design, Roofing Materials, Constructing a Pole Building, Pole Barn Planning, Trusses, Rebuilding Structures, Professional Engineer, Lumber, Pole Barn Questions and tagged , , , , , , , on by .

PBG Bonus Round 3– Column Material, Insurance, and Barn Doors

Today’s BONUS round of the PBG includes questions about column advice, liability insurance to harvest reclaimed wood, and parts for used pole barn doors.

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: My barn will be 9’4″ to the eave, 40′ x 64′ long.

What column material should I use? My options are 4″x 6″ Pressure treated wood or finger-jointed glulams consisting of (3) 2 x 6 which are only treated on the bottom 6′. RANDY in NEW YORK

DEAR RANDY: This is why you should only build from a fully engineered set of plans. Your engineer of record will take into account things like – design wind speed, wind exposure, snow loads, soil bearing capacity, will there be a slab on grade or not, interior finished or not, roof dead loads (ceiling, roofing materials), slope of roof, column spacing, walls open, enclosed, partially enclosed, etc. to determine proper column size for your specific building. If you do not have engineered plans, go invest in them now.

I can tell you glulaminated columns are significantly stronger.

 

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: Planning a build with reclaimed lumber. Plenty of barns to reclaim. But owners want you to have insurance, which is a good plan for both parties. Having a hard time since we are not a business.

Any idea where we can get personal general liability insurance? DEE in MOUNT STERLING

DEAR DEE: You may need to form a business entity in order to get sufficient insurance to provide adequate coverage. Contact whomever you have home owner’s insurance with currently, as your agent should be able to either write a policy, or provide you with a referral to someone who can.

 

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: Hello, do you buy used steel pull barn doors? I have two, 7×10 that I’d like to sell. Please let me know.

Thank you! RIAN in ST. Paul

DEAR RIAN: Thank you for asking, however we use no used materials in our buildings. You might offer them for sale on Craigslist.

 

 

 

This entry was posted in Pole Barn Questions, Pole Barn Planning, Rebuilding Structures, Columns, Sliding Doors and tagged , , , on by .

Scissor Trusses, Hanger Bolts, and Foundation Options

This week the Pole Barn Guru answers questions about scissor trusses, wood framing and hanger bolts for sliding doors, as well as a foundation option for a post frame house.

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: I have a 30×40 pole barn. And my lower beam on the trusses is to low for my car lift. Is scissor trusses as strong or stronger then common trusses and I know without a engineer doing the math it’s hard to say. ZACH in ATASCOCITA

DEAR ZACH: Scissor trusses can be engineered to be every bit as strong as conventional trusses. If your idea is to swap out some or all of them, you would be looking at a highly labor intensive project. It might very well be less expensive to just add a taller bay onto one end of your building.

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: The round rail hanger bolt on our sliding door got pulled out of the hole drilled through the 2×6 at the top of the door. We have made angle iron for the top and bottom of the 2×6 with 1/2in holes but are finding it difficult to get the bolt through the holes. Is there an easy way to reinstall the door hanger without removing the entire door from the track? AARON in MARYSVILLE

DEAR AARON: You have just discovered one of many reasons why sliding doors should not ever be framed out of lumber. Steel door components (such as horizontal girts) are far superior in every way. They are stronger against wind loads, they do not warp or twist, doors are phenomenally lighter weight and trolley hanger bolts never pull through!

In direct answer to your question – you are going to have to remove entire door, reinstall trolley hanger bolt and rehang door. This might be an ideal time to totally replace your wooden components.

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: Can a pole barn be a permanent house residence, and can they be built on a walled foundation? TERRY in AKRON

DEAR TERRY: Post frame (pole barn) buildings can be permanent residences – I happen to live in one myself, with about 8000 square feet of finished space. They can be built either with embedded columns, or on a partial or full foundation. For more information please visit www.HansenPoleBuildings.com , navigate to upper right corner of the page and click on SEARCH type BARNDOMINIUM in search box and click ENTER. This will bring up a plethora of relevant articles for your reading enjoyment.

 

 


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This entry was posted in Pole Barn Planning, Trusses, Footings, Pole Barn Homes, Sliding Doors, Pole Barn Questions and tagged , , , , on by .

Sliding Doors, Building Height Increase, and Wind Ratings

Today’s Pole Barn Guru answers questions about why Hansen does not sell sliding doors without the rest of the building, creating more space in an existing building, and wind rating comparison of post frame, stick built, and steel frame buildings.

Figure 27-3

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: Hello.  I saw a video of a heavy duty hardware for sliding doors on YouTube which I’m curious if you sell. I’m building a boat house in a restricted covenanted subdivision in south Mississippi using standard home construction.  I’m trying to find hardware to accommodate two 7 wide x 14 tall Hardie sheeted doors. Do you have hardware?  If so, how much and what is the availability? ROD in MISSISSIPPI

DEAR ROD: Thank you very much for your inquiry. Due to challenges of shipping sliding door components without damage, Hansen Pole Buildings only supplies doors with an investment into a complete post frame building kit package. You might try reaching out to I-Beam Sliding Doors at (800)776-3645 and be sure to tell them I sent you.

 

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: I’m writing to you from one of your old states, Idaho. I just bought a 10 acre farm which has a pole barn; dirt floor, no power, etc. I would like it to be taller so I could pull my camper into it but it only has a standard 8’ tall door. I have been thinking that rather then trying to raise the roof, perhaps I could or should dig down a couple of feet and pour a concrete pony wall all around it and then pour my concrete floor. So I guess my question to you Mr. Pole Barn Guru is, which is going to be the better or more economical way to go? Raise the roof or dig the foundation down deeper? Thank you for your time! TRAVIS in NAMPA

DEAR TRAVIS: How about choice C?

Attempting to increase your building’s height is going to require services or a Registered Professional Engineer to ascertain what modifications would need to be done in order to ‘raise the roof’. Besides his or her services, you will have materials and lots and lots of labor and equipment rentals.

Concrete pony walls are not an inexpensive proposition, plus you are disrupting existing column embedment – again an engineer should be involved. If you go this route, you will also have to deal with a downward sloping approach into your door.

Choice C – erect a new third-party engineered post frame building kit to fit your camper. When all is said and done, this will probably be your least expensive as well as best structural option.

 

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: What is the wind rating on pole barn compared to steel or frame buildings? RONNIE in REEDVILLE

DEAR RONNIE: Any type of building system can be engineered (emphasis on “engineered” as being actually designed by a Registered Professional Engineer) to resist a given wind speed and wind exposure. What makes a huge difference is what sort of financial investment comes along with increasing a system’s ability to support increased loads. Post frame (pole barn) construction boasts of some efficiencies in regards to increased wind design other systems lack. By having columns embedded in ground and running continuously vertically, without joints or hinges (such as stick frame) weak transition points between foundations and walls, as well as wall/floor/walls are eliminated. Post frame buildings have fewer connections, in general, and connections are weak points of any structural system.

As you shop for a new post frame building, investigate added investment in increasing design wind speeds by 10, 20 or even more mph (miles per hour) beyond Building Code ‘minimal’ requirements. You might be surprised at how little of a difference actually exists!

 

This entry was posted in Pole Barn Questions, Constructing a Pole Building, Professional Engineer, Sliding Doors and tagged , , , , on by .

Proper Foundation and Slab, Two-Story Buildings, and Door Parts

Proper Foundation and Slab, Two-Story Buildings, and Door Parts

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: Dear Sir, I read the details of pouring a concrete slab after building the barn. I live in Montana with some pretty cold winters. If I were laying a slab for a conventional stick built structure i would be required to dig footings 48” deep all around the perimeter. What should I do if I am building a pole barn? While I may supply low level background heat I would like a construction that does not require it to resist Montana winters.
Regards, DEREK in KALISPELL

DEAR DEREK: Regardless of the type of construction used, the success or lack thereof for your slab is going to come from what you do underneath it, as well as grading the site properly to keep water from pooling below it.

Follow along first by reading my series of articles devoted to site preparation which begins with: https://www.hansenpolebuildings.com/2011/11/site-preparation/.

You will want to have your building site graded so as there is a 5% slope away from the building, when completed.

Now the fun part – protecting your building itself. I’ve become an advocate for Frost-Protected Shallow Foundations. Here are a couple of articles which should get you heading in the right direction: https://www.hansenpolebuildings.com/2016/11/frost-protected-shallow-foundations/

and https://www.hansenpolebuildings.com/2017/09/post-frame-frost-walls/.

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: Do you offer 30 x 40 2 story apartment/garages?? ROB in ALPINE

About Hansen BuildingsDEAR ROB: We offer any dimension of footprint you desire, not just 30 foot width by 40 feet long and would encourage you to look at what works best for you in an internal layout, then create the exterior dimensions which best fit your interior needs. Two and even three full or partial stories can easily be done with post frame construction and if your zoning allows the overall height and you are willing to add sprinklers, you could go four stories.

Your mixed use will probably result in having to at least one-hour fire separate the apartment from the garage. This could include having to protect the stairs, if they are interior, as well as to provide clear protection all the way to the outside world. A discussion with your local planning and zoning friends could provide you with added insights.

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: Do you have available, either metal or wood, a barn door and hardware for an opening 8′ high and 5′ wide, to be placed within a screen porch (the entrance to the garage)? TRISH in WIMBERLEY

DEAR TRISH: Thank you for your interest. Due to shipping challenges, we now only provide barn doors along with the investment into a complete post frame building kit. You might try contacting the ProDesk at your local The Home Depot®.

 

 

 


This entry was posted in Pole Barn Questions, Footings, Pole Barn Homes, Workshop Buildings, Sliding Doors and tagged , , , , , , on by .

To Remove, To Replace, and To Design!

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: Hey Guru! I’m getting ready to build a pole barn and I will have to remove a tree. The tree is basically right in the middle of what the floor will be. I will be putting a concrete floor in and was wondering do I have to completely remove the stump or can I just cut it down below grade and cover it with dirt and gravel? MARK in BROKEN ARROW
DEAR MARK: Completely remove it. You do not want any sort of organic material to remain under a building site. Eventually it will decay, sink and if you have poured a concrete slab over it, the slab could fail any you could find yourself parked in the bottom of a hole in the middle of your barn. Stump removal is relatively inexpensive – and it is something you could probably do yourself along with a properly sized piece of excavation equipment.

 

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: We have a pole building that had a 12’ X 12’ slider door that was recently damaged and needs replaced. Can you point me in the direction I need to go to get a replacement. We wanted to replace it with an overhead door but do not have sufficient clearance for our motorhome. JOYCE in FRANKLIN

DEAR JOYCE: Replacing a sliding door with an overhead door can end up being a near epic challenge as the opening sizes will not be the same. At the very least it will necessitate a custom width overhead door. Before you get too deep into the process, contact three local overhead door companies and ask each to come out to give you a quote on the door. They will be able to tell you what the maximum height is you will be able to get into your building (keeping in mind this may necessitate increasing the height of the door opening). Once this step is done, if you are not already over budget, run an ad on Craigslist under “gigs” best describing the work to be performed – which should include replacement of all of the steel siding on this wall of the building (otherwise it is never going to look right). I have no idea how large your building is, but could easily see this as being a three to five thousand dollar price tag before all is said and done.

Which leads back to – the solution might be to bite the bullet and just replace the sliding door with a new sliding door. You can probably get all of the needed components by a visit to the Pro Desk at your local The Home Depot®.

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: Storage for trailer 35 ft what is a pole distance set with 10 – 12 ft opening? TRACY in NAMPA

DEAR TRACY: I will have to read between the lines here and hope I am able to provide an answer which fits with what your question truly is.

For starters, if I had a 35 foot long trailer to get through a door, I want the opening to be about 12 feet wide. Going 10 feet wide appears to me to be risking some damage.

If the door is to be a sliding door, the space from center of column to center of column on each side of the door should be 12 feet. This will allow the sliding door itself (which should be about 12’2” in width to cover the opening and provide an overlap on each side.

For overhead doors, if getting a residential overhead door, the space BETWEEN the columns should be 12’1”, so as when the 2x jambs are placed on each side of the opening, the finished opening will be 11’10” in width. This will allow the overhead door panels to overlap by an inch on each side. For a commercial overhead door, increase the width between columns by two inches.

 

This entry was posted in Pole Barn Design, Pole Barn Structure, Pole Building Siding, Columns, Sectional Doors, Pole Barn Questions and tagged , , , , on by .
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